I have to think that the Remington Co. has tech people monitoring sites such as this, in order to know what the actual consumer is experiencing with the product...(R51 pistol). I'd hope so, as a couple hundred guys buying, shooting, and obsessing over every little detail of the pistol is a true, real-world view of use of the product...
Art,
More than a couple of hundred. I am sure that there are many who go directly to
Big Green, or other forums. I know for a fact that RIA monitors the 1911 forums and
the .22TCM/9MM forums.
Of if Remington are not monitoring, then they are derelict in their duties.
Blackie
Quote from: springfield art on January 22, 2018, 04:02:41 PM
I have to think that the Remington Co. has tech people monitoring sites such as this, in order to know what the actual consumer is experiencing with the product...(R51 pistol). I'd hope so, as a couple hundred guys buying, shooting, and obsessing over every little detail of the pistol is a true, real-world view of use of the product...
I think you are giving Remington much too much credit if you think they spend time monitoring this site.
I don't doubt for a second that there are some Remington employees who frequent the message boards. As for corporate listening in and taking notes?, not a chance in hell.
Todd,
Very possible you are right. If so, bad on Big Green.
RIA, Ruger, etal copy us on our forums. but Big Green needs to start
doing the same.
Blackie
I believe there are plenty of competent, hard working, and consciousness engineers, technicians AND managers designing and building firearms for Remington. Certainly they are aware of all the problems and proposed solutions that have been discussed and proposed here and elsewhere.
Blame who you will for their production, marketing, and financial problems - but they got 'em. Right now their financial problems trump everything. I'm sure they feel the need to dedicate all their resources on prioritized tasks that will improve their bottom line the fastest by the highest margins.
I'd love them to solve the R51 magazine issues and I bet their folks would like to do so as well. But if the bosses have them working on stuff that has a better chance of keeping the company solvent, that is the way it is going to be for a while. None of us has visibility to the big picture. You can't hire workers you can't afford to pay. The ones that are there have to do the best job they can.
And before I get flamed - I don't except this as an excuse for poor quality and customer service - but I propose it as a plausible explanation.
Cur, you are right on the button and its been going on for years.
With all the raping the company has been through, its a surprise that the company has survived at all.
All just an opportunity for the smaller guys to serve the market demand... 8)
Brand loyalty is one of the fun aspects of firearms acquisition - kind of like the Ford, Chevy, Dodge thing. Then along comes Honda and Toyota and takes over the market for a quarter of a century.
It is sad to see ups and downs of all the big American brands. Everything else being equal, I'd rather own a pistol from an iconic American company. But all things are not equal. Glock, Sig, and so many others have very appealing value propositions in the market.
I wish Remington was as healthy as Sig right now.
Quote from: SCurmudgeon on January 25, 2018, 09:27:41 AM
I wish Remington was as healthy as Sig right now.
Kinda hard to argue with German quality ;) . However, I am proud to say I don't own of these polymer wonders yet. Just good old American steel. Oh, and a post war P38!
A couple of P320s here, that I need to send in and get updated with their "drop test fix"!
Something else with them, I can not bring myself to park either one in an IWB!
OWB, maybe but just havent done so as yet.
The triggers are more sensisitive than the R51 and NO SAFETY!
Have a Steyr .40, the very same way.
Gonna have to take a lesson from Blackie and convert to OWB and long shirt tails!
Quote from: R51Fan2017 on February 05, 2018, 03:17:48 PM
Quote from: SCurmudgeon on January 25, 2018, 09:27:41 AM
I wish Remington was as healthy as Sig right now.
Kinda hard to argue with German quality ;) . However, I am proud to say I don't own of these polymer wonders yet. Just good old American steel. Oh, and a post war P38!
Czech steel and quality are also superb, in fact better than most. I have a CZ83 and a CZ75 SP-01 Tactical. Both are all steel, will shoot anything I feed them, are extremely accurate and smooth shooting. They far exceed my Sig Blackwater, Beretta 92 and R51 - all three also made of all metal. The CZ's are the best pistols I have owned, ever.
I have a friend who has an FFL and a Class III license who will not purchase a US made handgun of any brand due to quality problems.
Quote from: DUTCH Van Atlanta on February 07, 2018, 09:28:11 AM
I have a friend who has an FFL and a Class III license who will not purchase a US made handgun of any brand due to quality problems.
No offense intended :) (really), but what planet did he just come from? Ruger is American, and their quality is superb. So is Smith and Wesson.
Georgia, apparently. If you haven't be, it's definitely another planet...
;D
Quote from: Engineerpower on February 07, 2018, 02:13:32 PM
Georgia, apparently. If you haven't be, it's definitely another planet...
;D
That friend lives in Florida, not Georgia.
Hey Guys,
Be nice. both mfrs are makers of quality guns.
I have a CZ Model 82, 9X18 and it shoots all day never a hiccup
Just like my R51s.
Blackie
I think Remington's problem is not so much the gun anymore as it is the magazines. I believe the gun is perfect. I have been leaving reviews on Bass Pro's and Academy's websites as well as Cabela's and others touting the R51, but also including comments on the magazines and what to do about that lip in the front. I hope it convinces a lot of folks to go and buy one now.
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on February 07, 2018, 11:22:47 PM
Hey Guys,
Be nice. both mfrs are makers of quality guns.
I have a CZ Model 82, 9X18 and it shoots all day never a hiccup
Just like my R51s.
Blackie
Wish my R51 did that. I consider it to be a single shot pistol because of the mag problems. One should not have to re-engineer the mags on a pistol from a supposed top of the line manufacturer.
I sent an email to Remington last week and mentioned that I thought the mags were/are crap. The person who responded said he agreed with me, and would send two newly designed ones at no charge. I don't have a whole lot of hope for improvement, but will post when I receive them and go to the range.
Quote from: DUTCH Van Atlanta on February 08, 2018, 04:47:31 PM
Wish my R51 did that. I consider it to be a single shot pistol because of the mag problems. One should not have to re-engineer the mags on a pistol from a supposed top of the line manufacturer.
I sent an email to Remington last week and mentioned that I thought the mags were/are crap. The person who responded said he agreed with me, and would send two newly designed ones at no charge. I don't have a whole lot of hope for improvement, but will post when I receive them and go to the range.
Dutch,
Keep us posted. Funny thing. I squawked a month or so back about the bad mags too. I got sent a mag that wasn't even in any factory packaging. Just a mailer envelope. To boot, the weld wasn't even finished on the bottom and the follower had even more slop than the previous mags. I think it was a factory reject they just sent back out trying to get rid of it. Who knows. Although, after some tinkering, it works plenty fine.
Quote from: DUTCH Van Atlanta on February 07, 2018, 02:18:17 PM
Quote from: Engineerpower on February 07, 2018, 02:13:32 PM
Georgia, apparently. If you haven't be, it's definitely another planet...
;D
That friend lives in Florida, not Georgia.
Georgia's just "the south". Florida's a whole different planet. spring break, grandma, and batsh** crazy. news story about neighbor getting naked and howling an the roof then running around town trying to eat people? just another day in Florida.
And there do seem to be more recalls from US makers. Smith's no exception from what I've read. Lots of revolvers making a trip back to the factory for stuff that shouldn't have passed QC. Fine otherwise and afterward but it's like nobody's even glancing at them after they roll off the line.