Let me start by saying that I really like the feel and accuracy of the R51. However, I have an issue with my R51 that I haven't seen posted.
When I have a full magazine (all 7 rounds) and insert the magazine while the slide is pulled back, the magazine inserts properly. I can release the slide and the first bullet gets chambered. Perfect!
However, if my slide is closed and I insert the magazine (with all 7 rounds), it goes in, but has a little different feel to it. But it is still properly secured. The issue is that under this circumstance, I cannot put the slide all the way back...maybe it goes back 1/2 to 3/4 ways. If I drop the magazine out, the bullet (or now I'm using snap caps) will have a little mark on the top side of the bullet. I do not have this problem if there are only 6 bullets in the magazine. It does this for both magazines.
I've field stripped it many times to see if Pederson device is in the proper spot or if there is anything between it and the slide or if there is any signs of wear. I don't see any issue.
Is this a problem or just normal operation?
I went to a local gun range and rented their R51. Using their R51, I inserted a full magazine (7) with the slide closed...and then was able to pull the slide back fully and then release to let a bullet load into the chamber.
How does your R51 handle a full magazine when the slide is closed?
I have the same issue. When I pull the slide hard enough, it will more back far enough to pick up and chamber a round. Doesn't happen unless the mag is full with 7 rounds. Seems to be getting easier as I shoot the gun.
I talked to Remington...they said it shouldn't be like that...so I sent it to them to determine what is going on.
I thought it could be the tight springs in my magazine, so I rented a R51 at a local gun range. The rental did not have the issue. I tried their magazine in my R51 and still had the same issue...this is why Remington wanted me to send the pistol to them.
Interesting, I've not actually tried that with mine, but now I will. My normal routine is to lock the slide back, insert a fully loaded mag, and hit the slide release. I have sort of weak hands anyway and found that pulling the slide back to chamber the first round can cause my AR9 to stovepipe the first round, my Bodyguard is the same way and I figured it was caused by me not being quick enough or strong enough to get the slide all the way back and release it cleanly, as though I was "riding" the slide and causing the problem myself. From that, my normal routine is to use the "slide release". Like I said, I'm going to try this and see what happens and I'll get back to the thread with the results.
Quote from: bonorden on August 25, 2016, 06:16:28 AM
Let me start by saying that I really like the feel and accuracy of the R51. However, I have an issue with my R51 that I haven't seen posted.
When I have a full magazine (all 7 rounds) and insert the magazine while the slide is pulled back, the magazine inserts properly. I can release the slide and the first bullet gets chambered. Perfect!
However, if my slide is closed and I insert the magazine (with all 7 rounds), it goes in, but has a little different feel to it. But it is still properly secured. The issue is that under this circumstance, I cannot put the slide all the way back...maybe it goes back 1/2 to 3/4 ways. If I drop the magazine out, the bullet (or now I'm using snap caps) will have a little mark on the top side of the bullet. I do not have this problem if there are only 6 bullets in the magazine. It does this for both magazines.
I've field stripped it many times to see if Pederson device is in the proper spot or if there is anything between it and the slide or if there is any signs of wear. I don't see any issue.
Is this a problem or just normal operation?
I have the exact same issue, only way I can shoot it with a full mag. is to lock the slide back, insert mag. and trip the release, doing it that way it runs flawlessly. Did Remington tell you how long it would take them to fix it?
They said it would be at least six weeks. It appears all R51 repairs are being fixed by a gun shop in Alabama. I talked to them about 3-4 weeks after I sent it in...he hadn't gotten to it yet...but said he hadn't heard of this problem. It will be interesting to see how it is fixed...if it comes back with an explanation, then I will share the details along with the turn-around time.
Thanks, waiting on your reply from Remington, I think I'll just shoot mine for awhile as it's a good shooter and send it in later if there is a factory fix.
My R51 has this issue and I am very much interested in the answer from Remington.
Ok...I've got some feedback from the gun shop that Remington has repairing the R51s. They believe it is a magazine issue (even though it is a Gen2 magazine). He said Remington is redesigning the magazine (again). However, they do not have a timetable for when the new magazines will be available...sigh...my R51 was shipped to them on September 1...coming on 7 weeks. And they are not completely sure this will fix the issue.
I really thought they would have worked out all the kinks after Gen1...
Quote from: bonorden on October 19, 2016, 04:18:07 PMHe said Remington is redesigning the magazine (again).
I'm not surprised. It appears that some people are having nosedive issues with flat nosed (such as many hollow point) ammunition in the magazines. They nose down juuuusssst enough to catch on the front "lip" of the magazine body. This doesn't seem to affect cone shaped bullets such as FMJ, Pow'rBall, or Critical Defense/Duty. I believe that one user posting here has reduced the front of his magazine body as an experiment and reported success. Dremel FTW! ;)
I have seen what I believe to be indications of the bullet scraping on the front of the magazine body.
(http://www.hipointfirearmsforums.com/forum/attachments/f277/35655d1476982762-r51-take-two-r51-magazine-scrape.jpg)
I might give the front lip of my Gen 1 magazine body a dremel treatment too. :)
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
Quote from: bonorden on October 19, 2016, 04:18:07 PM
Ok...I've got some feedback from the gun shop that Remington has repairing the R51s. They believe it is a magazine issue (even though it is a Gen2 magazine). He said Remington is redesigning the magazine (again). However, they do not have a timetable for when the new magazines will be available...sigh...my R51 was shipped to them on September 1...coming on 7 weeks. And they are not completely sure this will fix the issue.
I really thought they would have worked out all the kinks after Gen1...
After the eternal wait for my Gen 2 I would have to be really desperate before sending anything back to Remington again for a fix.
The gun shop doing R51 repairs said they have received a lot of R51s in the last week.
I agree with Red Horse...I wouldn't send my R51 back unless it was absolutely necessary.
To Remington's defense, they could send me my R51 back unrepaired...but then they wouldn't know if their "magazine fix" would work (and I would be back to the end of the line if I sent it back to them later)...
Quote from: bonorden on October 20, 2016, 09:08:59 PM
The gun shop doing R51 repairs said they have received a lot of R51s in the last week.
I agree with Red Horse...I wouldn't send my R51 back unless it was absolutely necessary.
To Remington's defense, they could send me my R51 back unrepaired...but then they wouldn't know if their "magazine fix" would work (and I would be back to the end of the line if I sent it back to them later)...
What is the name of the outfit doing the repairs.? Any contact info?
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on October 21, 2016, 11:16:27 AM
Quote from: bonorden on October 20, 2016, 09:08:59 PM
The gun shop doing R51 repairs said they have received a lot of R51s in the last week.
I agree with Red Horse...I wouldn't send my R51 back unless it was absolutely necessary.
To Remington's defense, they could send me my R51 back unrepaired...but then they wouldn't know if their "magazine fix" would work (and I would be back to the end of the line if I sent it back to them later)...
What is the name of the outfit doing the repairs.? Any contact info?
Mine went to Mark's Outdoor Sports, ims.
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
Mine went to Marks as well.
One of the frustrating things about that is it takes it out of Remington's repair system. You can't enter your information on their website and get updates.
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
I just got my R51 back today. But the same problems still exist. I hoped for better after Remington had my R51 for 3.5 months. I give up.
wow it is hard to believe all the problems with the Remington r51's I know I am not pleased with mine. I would like to take it apart to clean it again but I had to get my son to help me last time and it took both of us. I have arthritis in both hands and there is no way I can pull that damn spring back. I really wanted my r-51 and am very disappointed I expected more from Remington. maybe they should recall all of them again and make an effort to really make them work. it is possible to work around most of the problems like making sure the slide is back before loading, loading only 6 rounds, not using hollow point ammo, but there is no way we should have to make excuses for the quality of a Remington product. they should work and work all the time and not have to mess with half measures.
Couple of thoughts. There is likely a great opportunity for someone to invent a fixture which helps those of us with old hands to disassemble and assemble the R51.
Second, I'm a little fascinated with all the complaining about pistol not functioning. I've shot hollow point and ball ammo in mine to the tune of over 300 rounds and haven't had any problems.
Red Horse,
I too have a big problem with that *&^%$ Action spring. If Remington comes up with a
tool for holding the barrel while removing the slide from the frame, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
I love shooting my R51, but I would dang near pay to have it cleaned.
RE: Complaints about the pistol, compared to the number sold, as opposed to the members
on here, the ratio is not so bad. Remington Owners.com even less so. If Remington would just
admit they have a magazine problem, it would solve about 90% of these complaints I believe.
Blackie
Quote from: RED HORSE on December 14, 2016, 05:08:28 PM
Couple of thoughts. There is likely a great opportunity for someone to invent a fixture which helps those of us with old hands to disassemble and assemble the R51.
Second, I'm a little fascinated with all the complaining about pistol not functioning. I've shot hollow point and ball ammo in mine to the tune of over 300 rounds and haven't had any problems.
RED HORSE,
I agree with you on the ammo. I have shot Ruger ARX, Winchester USA Forged, White Box, reman ammo, Federal and Blazer, and several self defense brands, and everything I had in my ammo locker. Not a hiccup in a carload!
Aside from the Mag problem, which I solved to MY OWN satisfaction, and cleaning the pistol, I love it.
Blackie
Quote from: RED HORSE on December 14, 2016, 05:08:28 PM
Couple of thoughts. There is likely a great opportunity for someone to invent a fixture which helps those of us with old hands to disassemble and assemble the R51.
Second, I'm a little fascinated with all the complaining about pistol not functioning. I've shot hollow point and ball ammo in mine to the tune of over 300 rounds and haven't had any problems.
Red,
How about a threaded barrel, with a handle mated to it, and you could screw the handel on the barrel, and hold it while removing the slide from the frame.
Of course, that would not help with getting the *&^(* action spring out of the slide. I would sure like to see that little lady at the shot show rack my
R51 with one finger!
As for second, I shoot all types of ammo in my R51, just because I can. I have not tried Tulammo steel case yet, but I have shot about 600 rounds
of Winchester USA Forged which has steel cases, and no problems. It all goes BANG! No feed problems, ejection problems at all. Oh, I have not
tried aluminium cases. Just because I do not have any.
Now, if we could just get Remington to listen to us old farts, and do something about that *&#$@ action spring, we would be fat happy cats, right?
Quote from: RED HORSE on December 14, 2016, 05:08:28 PM
Couple of thoughts. There is likely a great opportunity for someone to invent a fixture which helps those of us with old hands to disassemble and assemble the R51.
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on December 16, 2016, 10:08:23 AM
I too have a big problem with that *&^%$ Action spring. If Remington comes up with a
tool for holding the barrel while removing the slide from the frame, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
I love shooting my R51, but I would dang near pay to have it cleaned.
I had tried several different things to help with the disassembly and then the simplest one worked the best. I cut a small block of wood and place it like this and the slide comes right off without having to hold the barrel. I also use it for reassembly as I can't seem to get mine on without having the barrel forward. If you cut the block just the right size, you can also remove/install the takedown lever without having to move the slide.
(http://i63.tinypic.com/20fxlaq.jpg)
Quote from: Texas-Mark on December 22, 2016, 08:03:38 AM
Quote from: RED HORSE on December 14, 2016, 05:08:28 PM
Couple of thoughts. There is likely a great opportunity for someone to invent a fixture which helps those of us with old hands to disassemble and assemble the R51.
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on December 16, 2016, 10:08:23 AM
I too have a big problem with that *&^%$ Action spring. If Remington comes up with a
tool for holding the barrel while removing the slide from the frame, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
I love shooting my R51, but I would dang near pay to have it cleaned.
I had tried several different things to help with the disassembly and then the simplest one worked the best. I cut a small block of wood and place it like this and the slide comes right off without having to hold the barrel. I also use it for reassembly as I can't seem to get mine on without having the barrel forward. If you cut the block just the right size, you can also remove/install the takedown lever without having to move the slide.
(http://i63.tinypic.com/20fxlaq.jpg)
Howdy, Texas Mark,
You are the hero of every one of us old farts who own an R51. That block of wood trick is a doozie.
From one Texan to another, my channel locks, my barrel and I thank you.
How about working on that *&%$# action spring now? We will be indebted to you forever!
Blackie
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on December 22, 2016, 09:58:41 AM
Howdy, Texas Mark,
You are the hero of every one of us old farts who own an R51. That block of wood trick is a doozie.
From one Texan to another, my channel locks, my barrel and I thank you.
How about working on that *&%$# action spring now? We will be indebted to you forever!
Blackie
Glad to be of help. The rear of the wood bock needs to rest on the slide as shown as to not interfere with the breech block.
Not sure what you mean by working on the action spring, but I still have a bit of a problem getting the barrel back into the slide. I have an idea to make sort of a shim to help push the bushing forward as you put the barrel back in, but I have to think about that a bit more.
But I also made this "thumb saver" out of a paint brush. It already has a hole in the handle and I just sanded down the sides a bit to fit in the slide and it makes it a lot easier to manipulate the barrel without the feed ramp digging into your fingers.
(http://i63.tinypic.com/148ztib.jpg)
I really like the great ideas that have come up like the wooden block to help in takedown. the issue I have is Remington should come up with the means to disassemble the pistol. I have read many excuses on this forum, like the type of ammo only closing the slide with the slide stop when loading 7 rounds etc. my issue is there have been many excuses made by some for a poorly designed pistol. it should work and work with all reasonable ammo. the slide should be able to be pulled back on a loaded magazine. what about those who want to carry with an empty chamber point is it is a 7 shot pistol and we should be able to load 7 rounds. the slide shouldn't cut the hand with firing the pistol. at least Remington could have rounded the back of the slide. with most loads it shoots low, actually I haven't found a load that shoots to point of aim. about the only really good thing about the new improved Remington model 51 is that it looks great. looks however don't mean much with a pistol that has massive problems. lets quit making excuses for Remington and tell it like it is....... these pistols have issues that are not fixed yet. Now for those of you who really have a trouble free Remington more power to you, for the rest of us well lets just admit the problems. I bought mine because I own the older m-51's in 32 and 380 acp and to carry for protection I cant carry a pistol of less than 100% reliability so mine is sitting in the safe wasted money. argie1891 aka Joe from selah wa.
Quote from: argie1891 on December 23, 2016, 03:04:13 AM
..... the slide shouldn't cut the hand with firing the pistol. at least Remington could have rounded the back of the slide.....
While I agree with most of your other points, I have to question this one. How is your hand getting cut? I have big hands and the slide comes nowhere near it with a proper grip.
As for the racking the slide with 7 rounds, at first I could not do it either. But I have shot about 500 rounds now and have left the mags fully loaded. Now that the mag springs have taken a set, I can now rack it fairly easily with 7 rounds. As I mentioned in another thread, it is not unusual for mag springs to be very stiff at first.
Now the takedown, I totally agree with. The SA EMP comes with a little clip to put on the guide rod to aid in disassembly otherwise it would be very hard to take down without it. Of course I hate that any special tool is needed to take down a gun, but Remington should have devised something to help with the takedown.
Quote from: bonorden on August 25, 2016, 06:16:28 AM
Let me start by saying that I really like the feel and accuracy of the R51. However, I have an issue with my R51 that I haven't seen posted.
When I have a full magazine (all 7 rounds) and insert the magazine while the slide is pulled back, the magazine inserts properly. I can release the slide and the first bullet gets chambered. Perfect!
However, if my slide is closed and I insert the magazine (with all 7 rounds), it goes in, but has a little different feel to it. But it is still properly secured. The issue is that under this circumstance, I cannot put the slide all the way back...maybe it goes back 1/2 to 3/4 ways. If I drop the magazine out, the bullet (or now I'm using snap caps) will have a little mark on the top side of the bullet. I do not have this problem if there are only 6 bullets in the magazine. It does this for both magazines.
I've field stripped it many times to see if Pederson device is in the proper spot or if there is anything between it and the slide or if there is any signs of wear. I don't see any issue.
Is this a problem or just normal operation?
Bonorden,
It is not your imagination. The slide will not rack with a full loaded magazine. My fix is to leave the slide locked open, insert the magazine, pull back on the open slide and
let it slingshot back. Then, I take the magazine out, replace the seventh bullet and it is good to go. on the range, I just bite the bullet (pun intended) and shoot six times and
reload.
Blackie
Argie,
We are not making excuses, we are giving symptoms of our problems which Remington "appears"
not to be paying attention to. Yes there is a problem racking the seventh bullet into the slide on
many R51s. I leave the slide open, insert a full magazine (7 rounds), pull the slide back
and let it slam forward. My gun shoots this way all day. With any 115 gr ammo or +P ammo,
even Winchester USA Forged with steel cases.
My slide does not cut my hand, my hand gets abraded by the sharp edges on the lemon squeezer
in the handle. With my slide all the way locked back, and a normal firing grip, there is 3/8" of an inch
between the slide and the web of my hand. I bought a pair of shooters gloves and moved on.
Texas Mark did many of us a favour by coming up with that little block of wood to hold the
slide open on disassembly. I for one, as an old fart can use all the help I can get in this area.
We are trying to help each other through Remington's maze of hurdles, not trying to make
excuses. :)
Blackie
maybe my point wasn't taken the way it was meant... when I buy a new pistol I expect a short break in period, but having to come up with a solution to every problem is a bit too much to expect. so far we and I am included have come up with a solution to the 7 shot not feeding with racking the slide. heck it is easy load 6 or have the slide locked back, neither are really a fix. now the sharp edge on the rear of the slide it has only drawn blood once, but has scraped the web of my hand several times.
my real point is I think the design team at Remington could have and should have done a better job, They had a lot of time to work out the bugs it seems they didn't learn a lot from the time spent between the recall and the new issue.
it is really my fault I expected the 2nd issue to be perfection and it is far far from that. argie1891
I'm not disputing that there aren't some issues, but I don't understand the slide cutting thing. I just don't see how the slide can rub against ones hand if they are properly gripping the gun. And I personally have not had any issues with the grip safety biting either. I shot 200 rounds today and had zero discomfort.
The 7 round thing IMO is also just a break in thing. As I mentioned, I initially could not rack it with a full mag either. But after several hundred rounds and keeping the mags full, I can now rack it with a full mag fairly easily. it's still not as easy as some other guns, but it doesn't hang any more now that the mag springs are broken in.
The takedown though is indeed an issue that should have been thought out a little better. If I had the time I could probably make something better than my block of wood fix. Something that fits into the chamber like one of those unloaded flags that you see come with some guns. So I agree that Remington could have done better on that.
But IMO the positives about the gun far exceed the negatives. I have a LOT of guns and the R51 is one of my favorites to shoot.
Quote from: 1911SHOOTER on December 23, 2016, 12:16:46 PM
Quote from: bonorden on August 25, 2016, 06:16:28 AM
Let me start by saying that I really like the feel and accuracy of the R51. However, I have an issue with my R51 that I haven't seen posted.
When I have a full magazine (all 7 rounds) and insert the magazine while the slide is pulled back, the magazine inserts properly. I can release the slide and the first bullet gets chambered. Perfect!
However, if my slide is closed and I insert the magazine (with all 7 rounds), it goes in, but has a little different feel to it. But it is still properly secured. The issue is that under this circumstance, I cannot put the slide all the way back...maybe it goes back 1/2 to 3/4 ways. If I drop the magazine out, the bullet (or now I'm using snap caps) will have a little mark on the top side of the bullet. I do not have this problem if there are only 6 bullets in the magazine. It does this for both magazines.
I've field stripped it many times to see if Pederson device is in the proper spot or if there is anything between it and the slide or if there is any signs of wear. I don't see any issue.
Is this a problem or just normal operation?
Bonorden,
It is not your imagination. The slide will not rack with a full loaded magazine. My fix is to leave the slide locked open, insert the magazine, pull back on the open slide and
let it slingshot back. Then, I take the magazine out, replace the seventh bullet and it is good to go. on the range, I just bite the bullet (pun intended) and shoot six times and
reload.
Blackie
This is actually pretty close to the modern method. Lock the slide back, insert a mag with one round, let the slide close, eject the empty mag and replace it with a full one. This is because it's intended to mimic the methods used in "combat shooting." The current pervasive theory in "combat shooting" is to shoot until the mag runs dry and locks open the slide. Eject the empty, slap in a fresh, and manually jack the slide. On the range, do the same thing; shoot until the firearm locks open on an empty magazine, eject the mag, insert a fresh, and jack the slide. Most teach to jack the slide using an overhand method instead of the index-finger-and-thumb "slingshot" method because a lot of people do not have sufficient strength in the thumb and finger but can do a four-finger-to-palmheel "pinch." One of the reasons for shooting until the mag runs dry and lock the slide to the rear is because research and experience supports the believe that most people, when under "fight or flight" stress of adrenaline dump will press the trigger until the gun stops shooting. In other words, most people, when under "fight or flight," will fail to "count shots." So instead of trying to train people out of that (which can be done with some folks), most training should focus on working with the common "instinctive" responses.
So for a lot of people training with one of the common "modern" methods of loading and "combat reloading," this really isn't a big issue with the gun.
Your millage, of course, may vary. :)
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
Quote from: lklawson on December 28, 2016, 07:01:37 AMSo for a lot of people training with one of the common "modern" methods of loading and "combat reloading," this really isn't a big issue with the gun.
The problem is if for some reason the slide does not lock back during a SD situation. Slides not locking back on the last round for whatever reason are not unheard of. So IMO one should not train with the assumption that it will always lock back.
Quote from: Texas-Mark on December 28, 2016, 10:52:02 AM
Quote from: lklawson on December 28, 2016, 07:01:37 AMSo for a lot of people training with one of the common "modern" methods of loading and "combat reloading," this really isn't a big issue with the gun.
The problem is if for some reason the slide does not lock back during a SD situation. Slides not locking back on the last round for whatever reason are not unheard of. So IMO one should not train with the assumption that it will always lock back.
Guaranteed to be an issue with the magazine. Either the spring isn't strong enough to push the follower up fast enough to engage the last round hold open (LRHO) before the slide reciprocates forward or the flat on the follower which physically engages the LRHO lever is a tad too low to reach it.
(http://www.hipointfirearmsforums.com/forum/attachments/f277/36781d1482948787-r51-take-two-lrho.jpg)
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
I agree that most of the time it is mag related. However, I have seen people have issues with the slide stop on various guns too. Either mechanical failure of the stop, or user error of thumbing it down due to a poor grip.
But the point was that the hard racking could be an issue if for some reason the slide does not lock back when you need to reload in a SD situation. That is why IMO people should never train assuming it is always going to work. Just like they should also train for other malfunctions.
But there are also two issues here. The first is that the slide is harder to rack than many guns even if no mag is inserted. The other is that a full mag will be more difficult to rack initially if the slide is forward with a full mag inserted. That second issue will get better over time as I showed in the video in the other thread. But either way, one does not want to find themselves fumbling with trying to rack the slide in a SD reload situation. So IMO people should practice racking it from a full mag with the slide forward at least some of the time.
Now if one only plans to use the gun for the range then it does not matter.
Fair enough.
:)
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
I'm happy for the R51 owners that are not experiencing any issues with their handgun.
For me, field stripping the R51 wasn't that much of an issue (it could have been easier, but I knew this prior to my purchase). However, the failure to feeds and the difficulty racking the slide were unexpected. I gave Remington 3.5 months to fix it and they weren't able to.
After discussions, Remington has agreed to give me a refund on my R51.
Quote from: bonorden on December 30, 2016, 03:37:33 PM
I'm happy for the R51 owners that are not experiencing any issues with their handgun.
For me, field stripping the R51 wasn't that much of an issue (it could have been easier, but I knew this prior to my purchase). However, the failure to feeds and the difficulty racking the slide were unexpected. I gave Remington 3.5 months to fix it and they weren't able to.
After discussions, Remington has agreed to give me a refund on my R51.
Bonorden,
l Glad you got your issue resolved. Kudos to Remington for treating you right.
My R51 is still trucking along. I have used up all of my spare 9MM ammo in my range bag and started buying a different brand every weekend.
So far so good. Since I carry "Cocked and locked" the racking the slide over a full mag was no problem. Good luck down the road with
your future purchases.
Me, I would have gone for a swap for another R51. But that is me.
Blackie
Today I received a reply back form Remington that stated "The R51 is designed to require that the slide be locked back and then a full magazine be inserted", The reply informs me that I should not expect the pistol to function otherwise....What am I to make of this? I sent them another email asking if the R51 was never intended for CCW but I suppose that was a silly question as I always carry with a round chambered. I just think the individual should have the choice of one in the pipe or not.
Based on the answer I received, sending your gun in for this issue is simply a waste of time. Good luck to all, OM
Now I am really glad I quit waiting and moved on...
I am curious as why some R51s don't require this but some do (I rented one that worked either way)
Quote from: oldmagnolia on February 16, 2017, 09:54:34 PM
Today I received a reply back form Remington that stated "The R51 is designed to require that the slide be locked back and then a full magazine be inserted", The reply informs me that I should not expect the pistol to function otherwise....What am I to make of this?
I take responses from gun companies with a grain of salt. While I have not had any problems with racking with a full mag after the mag springs took a set, several people have had good results just shaving a bit off of the bottom of the follower. Seems there is a tolerance issue and just letting the top round move down a hair more by trimming the follower can make all of the difference. Note: No need to be cutting mag springs as also suggested.
http://r51pistol.com/r51-general-discussion/less-problems/msg946
Quote from: oldmagnolia on February 16, 2017, 09:54:34 PM
Today I received a reply back form Remington that stated "The R51 is designed to require that the slide be locked back and then a full magazine be inserted", The reply informs me that I should not expect the pistol to function otherwise....What am I to make of this? I sent them another email asking if the R51 was never intended for CCW but I suppose that was a silly question as I always carry with a round chambered. I just think the individual should have the choice of one in the pipe or not.
Based on the answer I received, sending your gun in for this issue is simply a waste of time. Good luck to all, OM
Old magnolia,
Your post is the first thing from Remington that makes a modicum of sense in the racking issue. I looked in the Manual for the R51 (GASP!)
and on pages 16 and 17, lies the vague answer. on page 16 para 5 and 6, it tells you to lock the slide back. Then, way over on page 17, para 12 and 13,
(beyond my attention span) it tells you to slingshot the slide. Nowhere does the book say, "do not rack the slide with a full magazine".
Remington could have saved a lot of us a lot of trouble with this one simple sentence.
They finally got a great little gun going in spite of themselves.
Blackie
BTW, Never ask Remington a sensible question. That is like herding cats!
OOPS! I meant para 11. and 12. Only adding to the confusion here huh?
Blackie
I worked at a gun range and had a few people with slides not locking back on last shots because their grip was pressing the thumbs against the side of the slide. That was enough to prevent locking back.
I've been able to rack with a full mag most times, but every now and then had trouble. Just went to locking the slide back before loading the mag and slingshotting. Never a problem doing it that way.
I have just loved the gun. I get bit on the web of my hand when practicing my draw & shooting, like in a self-defense situation. I guess it's just the chubby hands. Maybe I need more cant on my holster.
Sadly, my slide jammed on me and I couldn't move the slide more than 1/8". I fought it for a while and got it to budge, disassembled and recleaned it, only to have it do it again. Kind of hard to load that way!!! It's going back to Remington. They will also look at the low point of impact vs point of aim (8 inches low at 7 yards). I couldn't justify returning it for that alone. I miss it already!
Got the R51 back from Remington after only 2 months >:(
Slide was replaced. Functions fine. Still shoots low, but the "battle zero" may be the excuse.
Their repair tracking system was not functioning, so I had to email for status updates. They were really slow to respond. Calling them worked better, but it took a long time on hold to get through.
I still love the gun, but have lost respect for what is left of Remington. Too bad.
Hello, I'm new to the forum. I have probably put 2000 rounds thru my R51 and although I never really had a problem racking 7 rounds...
the last couple hundred rounds the slide suddenly doesn't hold open on the last round.
I clean it every 200 rounds or so and have had the same 4 mags since I purchased it. Any ideas?
As a side note... I was told by a friend to always keep your mags fully loaded at all times (especially on the R51) to help break in the mag springs because that 7th round is tight.
Quote from: peach2k on October 21, 2017, 11:15:18 AM
Hello, I'm new to the forum. I have probably put 2000 rounds thru my R51 and although I never really had a problem racking 7 rounds...
the last couple hundred rounds the slide suddenly doesn't hold open on the last round.
I clean it every 200 rounds or so and have had the same 4 mags since I purchased it. Any ideas?
As a side note... I was told by a friend to always keep your mags fully loaded at all times (especially on the R51) to help break in the mag springs because that 7th round is tight.
Arkis,
Do you have more than one Magazine? And, if so, does the gun not hold open with either mag?
Remington recommends to lock the slide open, insert the fully loaded magazine, pull the slide back
and release it. i think most of us have had magazine problems. I took out the mag follower on my mags and removed about 3/16" off
each leg. Don't know what to tell you about the slide staying closed after the last round. Try shooting only 6 rounds, see it the slide locks open.
It could either be a damaged mag, or it could be the slide locking lever.
Blackie
Hey Blackie
Thanks for your post. Thats the odd thing... I've had the same 4 mags since I got the gun. I always load all 4 mags at once then shoot and reload them again... so they each have the same range time and were broke in identically. that's what makes me think its the gun.
I will certainly try loading only 6 the next time I go out... to see if that makes a difference but it used to hold open with 7 on every mag. Honestly, I probably have closer to 3000 rounds thru her cause I stopped counting after the first 15 boxes. Its pretty much been a flawless gun but it won't cycle Tulammo so I only use brass. What's the chance the mag springs have weakened? Pretty unlikely right? ...Arlis
Does the slide hold open manually using the lever?... if not the slide or the lever or both are defective.
If it does hold open then you should be able to look through the port while seating an empty mag and see if the mag follower contacts the lock lever tab.
Seems you clean the gun plenty often... Ever had the mags apart to clean?
Quote from: peach2k on October 22, 2017, 12:37:47 AM
Hey Blackie
Thanks for your post. Thats the odd thing... I've had the same 4 mags since I got the gun. I always load all 4 mags at once then shoot and reload them again... so they each have the same range time and were broke in identically. that's what makes me think its the gun.
I will certainly try loading only 6 the next time I go out... to see if that makes a difference but it used to hold open with 7 on every mag. Honestly, I probably have closer to 3000 rounds thru her cause I stopped counting after the first 15 boxes. Its pretty much been a flawless gun but it won't cycle Tulammo so I only use brass. What's the chance the mag springs have weakened? Pretty unlikely right? ...Arlis
Hey, Arlis,
Have you tried Winchester USA Forged? It is American made, and my R51 eats it up. Good price too.
Springs should last a looong time according to an article I read, Nobody really knows!
Blackie
https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/magazine-springs-and-ammo-cycling/
Thanks for the tips. I hate to admit it but... I found why my R51 wasn't locking back on the last round. It wasn't the gun or the mags... it was my THUMB!! It would seem the more comfortable I became with the gun my grip changed slightly and my right thumb was resting on the slide stop just enough to keep it from popping up to catch the slide. Sooo... I just have to re-train my thumb to be elsewhere (At least during the last round) Thank you all for your support... Arlis
Quote from: peach2k on October 25, 2017, 04:40:25 PM
Thanks for the tips. I hate to admit it but... I found why my R51 wasn't locking back on the last round. It wasn't the gun or the mags... it was my THUMB!! It would seem the more comfortable I became with the gun my grip changed slightly and my right thumb was resting on the slide stop just enough to keep it from popping up to catch the slide. Sooo... I just have to re-train my thumb to be elsewhere (At least during the last round) Thank you all for your support... Arlis
Arlis,
Don't feel bad, many of us have done that and blamed the gin er uh gun. :)
Blackie
Winchester Forged, steel case is what I shot yesterday in the brand new gun that arrivied only yesterday.
And the steel cases are what I surmised just might have been some cause of the problems that I had.
That and the intutitively "wrong way" bend at the very forward lip of the magazines!
Why the hell are they bent "backwards"?
I am "guessing" that its a "nose dive" preventive?
It doesnt make sense to me, but way too early to start "re-bending"! I do have something else in mind to try first, if it comes to that.
Is one of the changes between the mags, issue 1 and II the raised forward hump in the follower, in version II?
Thanks for any and all info!
Jug
Quote from: Chokejug on October 28, 2017, 10:31:54 PM
Winchester Forged, steel case is what I shot yesterday in the brand new gun that arrivied only yesterday.
And the steel cases are what I surmised just might have been some cause of the problems that I had.
That and the intutitively "wrong way" bend at the very forward lip of the magazines!
Why the hell are they bent "backwards"?
I am "guessing" that its a "nose dive" preventive?
It doesnt make sense to me, but way too early to start "re-bending"! I do have something else in mind to try first, if it comes to that.
Is one of the changes between the mags, issue 1 and II the raised forward hump in the follower, in version II?
Thanks for any and all info!
Jug
Choke,
I have been shooting Winchester USA Forged in my R51 and had no problems. Not even one mishap.
Another problem I had was cured by taking 3/16 inch off the bottom of the mag followers.
But, no more than that.
Blackie
Well, finished up the last of the "Win Forged", without any more problems other than that which I first reported.
Changed my mind, I may well even buy more!
Especially for the second gun, finally coming today.
If they will run these, I feel that they most likely will run anything!