Grandson shoots the R51

[Ray R]

Last Saturday my 23 year old grandson, Mike, tried out the R51 against the S&W Shield and the Honor, all in 9mm Luger. I had him shoot on a sheet that had 5 bull's-eye targets. The 1st target was shot using the R51, the 2nd target was shot using the S&W Shield and the 3rd target was shot using the Honor. He repeated the full clip per target shooting sequence on the same targets to make sure his first efforts were not different due to unfamiliarity with the guns.

During his first attempt to shoot the R51, he kept locking up the trigger after firing a round. I found he was trying to shoot fast and pulled the trigger for the second shot before the R51's action had cycled. I explained what happened and told him to keep the trigger depressed until the gun finished recoiling and was coming back on target. He did that and had no further problems with the trigger.

These 3 Automatics are similar in size and we used Magtech 115 grain FMJ commercial ammo. Mike felt the R51 was the best looking, felt it had the most comfortable grip when firing, was the easiest to rack, and the lightest kicking of the three guns. He was also the most accurate when shooting the R51. He preferred the S&W Shield because the slide was farther from his hand than with the R51. He has fat hands that expand when he grips the gun and there was a grease line over his hand where the slide had made contact.

I had problems with my R51 at first due to the low grip I held to avoid contact with the slide. This caused some inconsistent feeding problems. I got a pair of thin shooting gloves the keep the skin of my shooting hand out of the way of the slide when I use the highest grip possible. I shoot much better with them because I don't need to worry about getting hit with the slide when firing. Wearing gloves for me is not a problem since I only plink and target shoot with my R51.

I was surprised Mike had his initial trigger problem. I forget that many people unfamiliar with handguns are unaware of the special requirements that different types of actions can have. With revolvers you must let the trigger fully release to reset. This requires a movement of much greater distance than with automatics. The salesman had mentioned it was a problem with the R51, but I had not heard of it until my grandson experienced it. I consider it a non-problem, but I can see how a novice shooter would be discouraged by it.

[1911SHOOTER]

Last Saturday my 23 year old grandson, Mike, tried out the R51 against the S&W Shield and the Honor, all in 9mm Luger. I had him shoot on a sheet that had 5 bull's-eye targets. The 1st target was shot using the R51, the 2nd target was shot using the S&W Shield and the 3rd target was shot using the Honor. He repeated the full clip per target shooting sequence on the same targets to make sure his first efforts were not different due to unfamiliarity with the guns.

During his first attempt to shoot the R51, he kept locking up the trigger after firing a round. I found he was trying to shoot fast and pulled the trigger for the second shot before the R51's action had cycled. I explained what happened and told him to keep the trigger depressed until the gun finished recoiling and was coming back on target. He did that and had no further problems with the trigger.

These 3 Automatics are similar in size and we used Magtech 115 grain FMJ commercial ammo. Mike felt the R51 was the best looking, felt it had the most comfortable grip when firing, was the easiest to rack, and the lightest kicking of the three guns. He was also the most accurate when shooting the R51. He preferred the S&W Shield because the slide was farther from his hand than with the R51. He has fat hands that expand when he grips the gun and there was a grease line over his hand where the slide had made contact.

I had problems with my R51 at first due to the low grip I held to avoid contact with the slide. This caused some inconsistent feeding problems. I got a pair of thin shooting gloves the keep the skin of my shooting hand out of the way of the slide when I use the highest grip possible. I shoot much better with them because I don't need to worry about getting hit with the slide when firing. Wearing gloves for me is not a problem since I only plink and target shoot with my R51.

I was surprised Mike had his initial trigger problem. I forget that many people unfamiliar with handguns are unaware of the special requirements that different types of actions can have. With revolvers you must let the trigger fully release to reset. This requires a movement of much greater distance than with automatics. The salesman had mentioned it was a problem with the R51, but I had not heard of it until my grandson experienced it. I consider it a non-problem, but I can see how a novice shooter would be discouraged by it.

Must be something wrong with my R51, it has a magazine!

[Texas-Mark]

During his first attempt to shoot the R51, he kept locking up the trigger after firing a round. I found he was trying to shoot fast and pulled the trigger for the second shot before the R51's action had cycled. I explained what happened and told him to keep the trigger depressed until the gun finished recoiling and was coming back on target. He did that and had no further problems with the trigger.

I don't think anyone can pull the trigger faster than the action cycles. Not letting up on it enough (which is not really that much) will however prevent a reset (which applies to all guns)

These 3 Automatics .....

Not to nitpick, but they are semi-automatics. Gun grabbers love to mistakenly call them automatics.

I forget that many people unfamiliar with handguns are unaware of the special requirements that different types of actions can have. With revolvers you must let the trigger fully release to reset.

I don't think there are any "special" requirements.  I have owned probably 100 different guns and never found any significant differences in how they operate. The only people that seem to ever have issues are those who obsess with reset distances and the tactile feedback of it.

The salesman had mentioned it was a problem with the R51...

The salesman did not know what he was talking about.

Must be something wrong with my R51, it has a magazine!

Nice one. 

[lklawson]

These 3 Automatics .....

Not to nitpick, but they are semi-automatics. Gun grabbers love to mistakenly call them automatics.

It's an old debate.  Here's the other side of it.  In 1905, John Mosses Browning developed the .45 ACP, not the .45 SACP.  Contemporarily to him and going up through at least the Korean Conflict, an "automatic" pistol almost always referred to what we currently call "semi-automatic."  You see it in all contemporary casual writing of the time, from official and semi-official news reports through popular fiction (for an example, see legendary writer E.E. "Doc" Smith's works, particularly the Skylark series).

It was always understood at the time to refer to how the chamber gets loaded.  It was an "auto-loader."

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[1911SHOOTER]

These 3 Automatics .....

Not to nitpick, but they are semi-automatics. Gun grabbers love to mistakenly call them automatics.

It's an old debate.  Here's the other side of it.  In 1905, John Mosses Browning developed the .45 ACP, not the .45 SACP.  Contemporarily to him and going up through at least the Korean Conflict, an "automatic" pistol almost always referred to what we currently call "semi-automatic."  You see it in all contemporary casual writing of the time, from official and semi-official news reports through popular fiction (for an example, see legendary writer E.E. "Doc" Smith's works, particularly the Skylark series).

It was always understood at the time to refer to how the chamber gets loaded.  It was an "auto-loader."

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

Kirk,
     Took the words right out of my mouth.  Even  the ACP abbreviation stands for
"automatic Colt Pistol".
Blackie

[Texas-Mark]

Well, as I said, the main problem is that the media and anti-gun crowd always mistakenly call guns "automatic", which to the uniformed means full automatic. IMO it's a bigger issue that mistakenly using the clip vs magazine term.

[lklawson]

Well, as I said, the main problem is that the media and anti-gun crowd always mistakenly call guns "automatic", which to the uniformed means full automatic. IMO it's a bigger issue that mistakenly using the clip vs magazine term.

I don't have a big problem with that either.  The terms were used interchangeably.  I have documentation that Stoner used the term "clip" for what we now call a Magazine and there is an official US Army manual for the 1911 (circa ~1912 or 1913 ims) which also refers to it as a "clip."

I understand that using the term "clip" for what we now call a magazine (or "mag") really tweaks some people today.  Personally, I do specifically use the term "magazine" just so I don't aggravate.  That said, the term "clip" for the device does have enough provenance to be considered accurate even if not, now, the preferred term and I usually won't correct someone in casual conversation.  I do, however, specify the term "magazine" when I'm teaching firearms classes.

It's sort of like the way spellings change.  For example, we now spell the word "clue" but in the late 19th century "clew" was an acceptable spelling. 

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk